Are you tapping into the power of social commerce? From boosted social commerce strategy and properly leveraging influence collaboration, discover how to boost your social commerce strategy for increased conversion and greater audience connection.

Explore platform integration and drive higher conversions with an authentic social strategy that integrates into your other marketing efforts. The social landscape is always changing, and adapting your partnerships and tactics alongside these changes is the key to staying ahead. Improve and maintain the social commerce health as platforms and audiences evolve.

Jump To:

Ruben Quinones (00:02): 

All right. Good morning, good afternoon, or good evening whenever you’re watching this. If you’re not live when you actually watch this. My name is Ruben Quinones, SVP client Strategy here at Amsive, and I’m particularly excited for today we’re going to continue our ongoing series around retail and eCommerce. So appreciate you joining us. And we’re doing this every three weeks, so if you haven’t already, sign up for the next one. We have that ready to go. That’ll be with Google in September. So we’re going into Q4.  

Today’s topic, particularly excited, is about social commerce. What is that today? What does that mean? And how do you effectively engage, sell, and influence? And we’ve got two great folks that are going to join us today. If you are or simulcast or if you’re on Meta or LinkedIn, feel free to leave a question and we will keep an eye on that in case there are any questions. So my first guest today is Chalice Jones. I’ll bring her aboard and well, I got to do that first. Chalice Jones, how are you? First off?

Chalice Jones (01:25): 

So good. Great. Thanks for asking, Ruben. 

Ruben Quinones (01:27): 

What do you do with us? You work here at Amsive. 

Chalice Jones (01:31): 

I do. We work together. It’s great. My name is Chalice. I’m director of Social and Influencer here at Amsive. I oversee our teams that provide organic social media strategy as well as influencer marketing strategies for our clients. 

Ruben Quinones (01:46): 

Very good. And I was going to ask you what your fun fact is. I haven’t heard this before, so I’m excited. 

Chalice Jones (01:53): 

Alright. My fun fact is that while I am very distant from it now, I had an early career on the screen as a baby, as the baby on days of our Lives for the first couple of years of my life. Oh, no kidding. I played Baby Isabelle Black with my twin sister Brianna, so that’s not…

Ruben Quinones (02:15): 

Fantastic. Can we hear you wailing or crying at all? Because I think you get paid for each one.

Chalice Jones (02:18): 

Perfect. Yes. And now I’ll get residuals.

Ruben Quinones (02:24): 

Exactly. And did you mention what you do here? 

Chalice Jones (02:27): 

Yes, I did. 

Ruben Quinones (02:27): 

Okay. You did. Alright. Well thank you for joining us. Our second guest we’re excited to have, and let me invite her. Kelly, I’m going to try to say your last name correctly. Kelly Wiethuchter. So close. You’re on mute. I think 

Kelly Wiethuchter (02:48): 

So. I am Kelly Wiethuchter. 

Ruben Quinones (02:50): 

Hi. Okay, so Kelly. Yeah, tell us what you do there at Tagger and tell us a little bit about Tagger as well. 

Kelly Wiethuchter (02:57): 

Yeah, absolutely. So Tagger is influencer technology platform that’s being used by agencies and brands all over the world. Last August, Tagger was acquired by Sprout Social, which has been really, really exciting to join their technology company and be a part of that community and obviously get Tagger into hands of more people who are activating influencers. So I’m on more of the sales side. I work with our agency and BRE and partners as they’re evaluating the technology, talking about their campaigns and strategies. 

Ruben Quinones (03:29): 

Very cool. Well, thank you for joining us today. And yeah, I’m particularly interested in hearing what your fun fact is. 

Kelly Wiethuchter (03:36): 

Well, Chalice, we didn’t talk about this, but I also had a moment on the small screen. I was on the Oprah Show in May. No, October of 2020. October. I’m sorry, take that back. I am totally lying. October of 2010. 

Ruben Quinones (03:54): 

You’ve got to get your dates right, you 

Kelly Wiethuchter (03:56): 

No, I cannot. I can’t believe I flub that. So October of 2010, I was on the Oprah show and I also had a cool experience a couple of weeks prior to that that got me on the Oprah Show. I was on Oprah’s Cash Cab. So Ben Bailey picked me and one of my besties up and we got to do Oprah trivia. We did really well and then got invited back to the Oprah show. 

Ruben Quinones (04:19): 

Very cool. You weren’t given anything, right? She used to give things away back in the day.  

Kelly Wiethuchter (04:24): 

Oh, I got some money, which was really lovely. Yeah. 

Ruben Quinones (04:28): 

Oh, the cash. 

Kelly Wiethuchter (04:29): 

Yeah, cash cab money. 

Ruben Quinones (04:31): 

Okay. Sorry, I haven’t watched too many. 

Chalice Jones (04:32): 

That’s a lot more memorable probably than mine. I cannot, I’ve just been told my whole life that was a fact about me. You at least have the experience behind it. 

Ruben Quinones (04:42): 

And again, I have amnesia short-term amnesia today. So did you talk about what Tagger does? 

Kelly Wiethuchter (04:49): 

Yes. Yes. Influencer technology company. So complete end-to-end solution from research and discovery through campaign management and then reporting. 

Ruben Quinones (04:59): 

Very cool. And obviously one of our partners on the social side, so glad to have you aboard. So yeah, let’s just dive right into it. When we talk about social commerce, this is an area that’s outside of the realm of what you do on site, especially for eCommerce.  

So many things you can do as far as channels driving to your site. But the landscape has changed over the last decade or so with a lot of these platforms. So curious to kind of define what social commerce is and what it is today, and maybe you can lead off on that. 

Defining Social Commerce

Chalice Jones (05:37): 

Yeah, so I think what’s really interesting about it is that it’s really just kind of taking eCommerce and getting it really focused in a specific area. So if we think about what eCommerce is, it’s going to be the selling across the internet, the general practice of those selling of goods and services and these different online forums. But with social commerce, it’s going to be focused just into the social media ecosystem. So what does it look like for a brand to sell, basically go through the entire, or for a consumer to go through their entire buyer journey all within the social applications?  

Ruben Quinones (06:16): 

Yeah, go ahead. No, sorry. I was going to say probably should have at least put this up. I mean, it’s not huge. 

Chalice Jones (06:19): 

Perfect! So this is a nice little just kind of visual to showcase how eCommerce is kind of the umbrella that spans a lot of different, probably subcategories and different ways you can look at it, mobile commerce, social commerce, but giving it a name like social commerce allows us to be a little bit more specific and tailored about coming up with a holistic strategy that’s tailored to just that one area and how we’re going to make sales in just this one space. 

Ruben Quinones (06:46): 

Yeah, yeah. So again, it’s all the things that you can do on your site that we’ve been talking about prior to this. And again, we’re focusing today. So the key characteristics that we typically when it comes to social commerce, what would that look like? And Kelly, you can chime in on that as well. 

Kelly Wiethuchter (07:05): 

Yeah, so I would say with social commerce, one thing to keep in mind is how your brands handle, whether it’s Instagram or Facebook or TikTok, how that really becomes your virtual storefront. I know, and we had a great conversation about this earlier in the week, but as you’re being introduced to new brands, maybe it’s through paid advertising or influencer, which we’ll talk about a little bit more. When you start to explore and check out those brands even before you potentially visit the brand’s website, are you going to their social handles?  

Are you seeing what their organic content looks like? Are they repurposing influencer content and seeing how real people are wearing or using or trying those items. And so I think that’s really important in social is to have that great brand voice even before you expect the user to flip over to your website. 

Ruben Quinones (07:55): 

Yeah, yeah. I guess it depends on the category of business that you’re in. I would assume you’re in the beauty business or the health business, health and wellness, maybe over index on social commerce versus others. Curious to what you guys might be seeing as far as yet we’re seeing more health, right? They’re definitely locked in, but are there other categories that are also kind of dipping into these platforms and doing a lot of social commerce today, just broadly? 

Chalice Jones (08:28): 

Yeah, I mean, I think the thing that it is just table stakes at this time, which is that brands are on social, we’re not making the argument they need to be on social. They are. And so really the conversation about social commerce is about are you using it to its fullest potential? Are you using this medium to really get the most out of it for your business? That answered your question about health and wellness versus fashion for those companies.  

Social commerce has been table stakes for a long time for those industries, right? It’s not new. They’re continually roll out new ways of how to leverage and utilize social commerce or new features on each of the apps that they can use. So of course, just like everybody else, they have to adapt and learn and try and dial it in. But I think a lot of what doesn’t get considered is that the conversation often gets focused on health and wellness, beauty, things like that because it is such table stakes, whereas there’s so many other e-comm businesses that could be leveraging it as well. It’s not only for those industries.  

And so if you have products that you can be selling and you have those eComm systems, it’s definitely seeing it as social commerce and not just your social media being a distribution channel for your general content or promotion back to your website. There’s some really great opportunity to really hopefully increase your revenue and increase your sales.  

The Creator Economy and Its Impact on Social Commerce

Ruben Quinones (09:56): 

Yeah, no, absolutely. And obviously it’s evolved. So yeah, you’re a brand, you got to be on social now. Talk to me, I guess about…You know, you kinda hear about the creator economy, and how does that kind of help influence or shape how brands are interacting with let’s say influencers? How does that look like in the last few years and what are we seeing today, Kelly? 

Kelly Wiethuchter (10:25): 

Yeah, absolutely. So obviously the social economy has grown significantly because of influencers and obviously not surprising. The pandemic really propelled that industry as we were all stuck at home with nothing to do, no malls to go into and things like that. That became our source of shopping and also entertainment as well.  

So yes, as the creator economy has continued to grow and of course technology is adapting and changing with Instagram shops and TikTok shop and things like that, creators are a vital part of that media mix. So the same way that agencies and brands have been thinking about how do we put paid media dollars into our Infeed ads, it’s now just working with creators. Is that essentially new ad unit, if you think of that way, 

Ruben Quinones (11:18): 

Right? Absolutely. Tell anything else to add to that, or? 

Chalice Jones (11:23): 

Yeah, I mean I think that it’s so cool how it just shaped to me it’s really about where we all are all the time. And the early influencers were really kind of more inspirational or aspirational. And I do feel a lot of it started happening through the pandemic and we had less glitz and glam and it got more lo-fi and that allowed for those more authentic opinions. And so I think that really as Kelly was saying, led to a huge rise or even bigger rise, even bigger push in that growth, which just made us all even more on socials and more adopters. And so that’s leading to a huge need.  

And so really at the end of the day when it comes to brands, it’s not just, yes, consumers are there, but it’s about meeting your consumers where they’re at and if they’re in the posture to be making purchases on social, if they’re in the mindset, then let’s capture them where they are rather than trying to ask them to do extra steps and then potentially missing that sale or that opportunity. 

Ruben Quinones (12:32): 

And again, I guess maybe going back to what we’re seeing as far as businesses tapping into either the trade or economy or just being on the social platform selling their products, and I guess I can contribute that to that a little bit too jealous, right? We’ve seen—seen growing B2B actually leveraging influencers, so we talk about how 

Kelly Wiethuchter (12:55): 

They’re usually called thought leaders in the B2B space though. Yeah, influencers is not usually the word that they like to be called. 

Ruben Quinones (13:02): 

Oh really? I’m learning something new. So don’t call ’em influencers. 

Kelly Wiethuchter (13:05): 

The B2B space. I think thought leader goes a little bit further. 

Ruben Quinones (13:09): 

Thought leader. 

Chalice Jones (13:10): 

Except for in finance, now it’s the influencers. 

Kelly Wiethuchter (13:13): 

There you go. 

Chalice Jones (13:14): 

I’m starting to see that a little bit. 

Ruben Quinones (13:15): 

I’m learning something today. So what other names do we have going on? 

Chalice Jones (13:19): 

Those are the big ones right now. Okay, 

Ruben Quinones (13:21): 

Got it. Gosh, I lost my train of thought. I’m sorry. No, no more than the categories of business. So B2B is one or health and wellness, CPG, Kelly, are you seeing any other evolving or merging categories of businesses that are leveraging these thought leaders? I want to make sure I say that. 

Kelly Wiethuchter (13:51): 

Definitely in the B2B space we’re having more and more conversations with those types of clients. A lot of them like healthcare and pharma, so trying to reach HCPs, healthcare providers and getting those doctors or nurses to recommend certain types of products to other doctors and nurses. We’ve even seen a lot of rise in agricultural influencers, so that’s sometimes lovingly called farm talk and things like that, but there’s a lot of farmers and growers that are out there that are talking about their industry, the types of equipment and combines and things that they’re using. So there really is a niche for almost anything as there’s little packets of different universes in the social sphere. 

Chalice Jones (14:41): 

Yeah, there’s this technical side too when we’re talking about social commerce as it is this branch of eCommerce or the subcategory, it’s that being able to make that final purchase in the app. Now there’s kind of the philosophical idea too of yes, if you are an eCommerce, you can still have your social operating as your storefront and you’re making it as easy to get to that final purchase place as possible, but when we’re talking about B2B, sometimes that purchase isn’t something you’re going to make an app, it’s a much longer sales cycle.  

We’ve got a lot more going on, but with social commerce specifically, I think really blobbing onto the tools and the applications within the platforms that they offer to be able to make those sales in without having to do anything else is really a great opportunity for if it is an agricultural business to leverage influencers in that space if it is something that they can purchase right there, even whether it’s merch or a tool or anything like that, using those influencers in those thought leaders in those spaces to be able to make those conversions on site. 

Kelly Wiethuchter (15:50): 

I agree with you. Going back to the whole social commerce and why we’re here, it does of course lend itself a lot more easy to CPG health and beauty clothing and things like that for sure. 

Chalice Jones (16:02): 

Yeah…There we go. Can’t hear you. I’m just going to add Bob Rubin’s figuring out a little bit too, which is that I think that’s kind of something we were saying earlier as well, which is that just because though those things do lend themselves doesn’t mean that they’re the only ones that can take advantage of it. There we were talking about maybe there’s a pool brand, maybe there’s some other kind of small business too that can be taking advantage of these features.  

So you don’t have to be, don’t write yourself out essentially if you’re not in health and wellness or beauty, things like that. If you’re selling a product and you have a large following that uses social, which is basically everyone, there’s an opportunity for you to find your niche. And again, if the pandemic taught us anything, it’s what they have been able to do with TikTok and finding there’s a niche for everything. There is a corner of the world for everyone, and so just because some voices are the loudest and the most dominating, that doesn’t mean that there aren’t us really solid, passionate, ready to purchase community that’s out there for your business. 

Choosing the Right Platforms for Social Commerce

Ruben Quinones (17:21): 

Yeah, sorry about before. I’ve some workers that give us 24 hour notice until they’re hear just banging away. So as far, again, this can be overwhelming, but maybe we could talk about what platforms are worth investing in, and I guess that depends on your audience.

So I know we have this graph here, but you guys can talk to me about what if you hadn’t done it before, where are we going to spend that time and what’s worth investing? Is it a TikTok, is it Facebook? And I’ll put this up as well. I guess it depends on, again, that audience. This is from you, a marketer, but maybe talk to me about what you’re seeing either at Tagger or here at Amsive. 

Kelly Wiethuchter (18:12): 

Yeah, so I can chime in. So from the research side is using those tools and technology to really understand your audience. Obviously this is very siloed, where’s Gen Z going versus millennials, but when you really get down to who’s that target audience, what are you trying to solve for them? Where are you reaching them? I think leaning first into doing the research and then deciding what are the appropriate channels and also where are you willing to activate. It’s probably not worth activating on TikTok if your brand’s not even participating in any organic content on TikTok. So I think you need to think a holistic strategy before you just run out there and have a bunch of people create content for you. 

Ruben Quinones (18:55): 

But this is interesting. Obviously we would’ve intuitively, TikTok has exploded over the last few years, younger generation, so if you don’t know where to start, I guess this is some good guardrails to look at. It was like, well, if we’re over indexing for Gen Z and TikTok, that’s probably worth our investment of resources and time. But Chaus, go ahead. 

Chalice Jones (19:21): 

So I think that Kelly and I were talking about this a little bit again earlier this week about when we talk about social marketing in general, there’s these assumptions. People say, I want to reach a younger audience, so let’s be on TikTok. I want to reach Gen Z, I want to be on TikTok, but I think something we often forget before I say that really quick, I think another funny thing that a lot of us know, especially if you’re a Sprout user like us car users, when you’re looking at that engagement report often from Facebook, you see a lot of times when you get a new client, something in, you’re looking to kind of help it out. Those biggest engagers are women 65 plus on Facebook.  

I feel like you always see that it’s going to be the most powerhouse there, but I think one of the things that people make these assumptions are of in the last decade, what it was to be 65, 10 years ago is not what it is to be 65 today, but it is, we are all getting older and we’re bringing our habits and our media consumption behaviors with us, and so we have to get outside of thinking that we know intuitively what it is to be a certain age or a certain understanding or a certain behavior with that, and we have to really get into the research and understand what that demographic is doing, because some things are a little bit more age agnostic as well. 

So something like certain topics, certain industries might be really about a pain point more than they are about a demographic in terms of age. So really going back to what Kelly was saying, you said this as well, understanding deeply who your audience is and what resonates with them is the first piece. Then it’s layering it in with understanding where they like to engage and what they like to engage with, what type of content they’re used to consuming and what speaks to them. Then the last piece is that you have to layer that with what you’re able to execute.  

I think that’s one of the biggest things is that you can’t just go out there and be like, well, my audience is on TikTok, so we should be on TikTok. It’s like we should definitely consider it, but before we just jump in, we need to make sure that we can sustain that as a business or we’ve set ourselves up and we make certain choices to say yes to some things, no to others to be able to sustain that because we can’t just go make a profile and then not put anything on it and then expect there to be a really high return. 

We have to be actually investing the platform. 

Ruben Quinones (21:56): 

That sounds good. I was going to say. 

Kelly Wiethuchter (21:58): 

Yeah, going deep instead of shallow across a bunch of platforms is another good starting strategy is doing the research, figuring out which platform and then trying to do your best there, but also being nimble and willing to pivot when needed, 

Chalice Jones (22:16): 

And that’s where I think a really solid social strategy. There’s a foundational element. Yes, you should definitely, as you grow, different platforms have your different objectives, goals, potentially unique strategies that you have for each platform, but underlying, there should be a general social media strategy, so you can make those pivots quickly and you can adapt again in one of these eMarketer reports that kind of came with some of one of the graphs that we showed is talking about agility, and that’s moving at the speed of social and being able to adapt as quickly as possible, which means yes, having a game plan, but also having almost a set thought process established with your brand and with your social strategy, so that way you know how to make choices so you can make them quick. 

Ruben Quinones (23:06): 

Yeah, I guess for a brand that’s not activating in social commerce or they’re doing it, use your term Kelly, they’re shallow in it would a good way to see if it’s worth the time is besides audiences and age groups by platform, it’s also looking at these thought leaders and who their audiences are. I assume that’s how much do we rely on, Hey, we know our audiences are on this platform versus this thought, I’m sorry, I’m going to say influencer. 

Kelly Wiethuchter (23:44): 

Yeah, say influencer. 

Ruben Quinones (23:47): 

Influencer, thought leader, whatever you want to be called. Do we emphasize one over the other? Is it really just both or It depends. 

Kelly Wiethuchter (23:57): 

I would say it depends. So looking at the layer of influencer and you’re starting to vet out who those creators are that you might want to work with to create that content. It’s looking at their audience demographics. I think it’s also looking at who are the brands that they’re talking about? Are those relevant brands that your target audience is also shopping?  

And so making sure that you’re picking creators that have that relevancy and authenticity already with their brand and that it feels aligned with who they are. If they’re going to come forward and talk about your brand and give their own perspective of why it’s the best or help to cure X, Y, Z, if it’s not similar to other brands that they’ve talked about in the past, it’s going to come off as a quick pay to play. 

Chalice Jones (24:46): 

Right. Yeah, I think that’s really a great point, Kelly, and I think that, what was it, the word of the year for 2023 was authenticity and the social community. We kept talking about how to be authentic, but it goes along with not just does this person have this need, but does it go along with the narrative of who they are? And they might have talked about something before if it’s a common service or a product or something that they’d be looking for all the time. But also if it’s something new that’s a kind of disruptor in the market, it still goes along with who they are. And it’s not just something as, I’m a mom, therefore I need lunch.  

Things like, no, if this person’s constantly talking about healthy foods and I like on-the-go stuff, and it’s really specific, the consumer continues to get smarter and smarter and smarter. We all are, again, as marketers, we have that same kind of ad blocker in our brains, and so we can snip it out really quickly when somebody’s not being authentic or it doesn’t really mesh with who they are and what they’re saying. 

Kelly Wiethuchter (25:52): 

That also kind of goes into the part of partnership length, right? When you work with creators, should it be a one and done, or should it be a longer-term partnership? And there’s a lot of studies out there that prove that it should be a longer-term partnership.  

Number one, it’s great for the creator to be able to know, okay, if this is my business is creating content, what type of payment do I have coming in? But it also gives them more of a vested stake to continue to do a good job. And it really backs into a true media concept of reach and frequency. You need to hear that person talk multiple times about how the product helped to save the day or this food was really loved by their family and here they are serving it to their family multiple times throughout the year. I think all of these little pieces come into play to build out a really strong, robust influencer campaign that’s going to drive social commerce. 

Challenges in Social Commerce and Influencer Marketing

Ruben Quinones (26:49): 

Yeah, no, it’s interesting. You hit on frequency, which traditional advertising, and it’s Nielsen tv, it’s also, it’s all GRPs and frequency and reach, and I still don’t know how that was measured back in the day, but we’re kind of challenged a bit more, but it’s almost like the same metrics. But yeah, they’re spending their time more and more on their phones.  

So you’re furthering that reach and that frequency. Now, I guess when it comes to dealing with influencers, thought leaders, and even within these platforms and setting up shop, what are we seeing are the main challenges in doing that that you guys are witnessing do? 

Chalice Jones (27:40): 

Challenges. I think we already kind of hit on one, which is just that we try to spread too thin rather than going deep. We are trying to do too much and be everything to everyone, but that doesn’t just with what platforms you’re on, but also with your messaging.  

I think a conversation we have with clients all the time and influencers, this is when we’re helping with influencer content development or organic social content, the exact same thing, which is that, hey, I want it to have a link and I also want it to have this other CTA though, but also want them to have a call to action that’s over here, but also let’s use 27 hashtags, et cetera, et cetera, et cetera. It’s like we’re asking a lot of the consumer, and I think that, I don’t want to say that. I think a crude way of saying it would be that sometimes we can be as consumers when we’re in the consumer posture, we can be lazy. 

But really it’s that I think about, again, that posture. When I go to pick up my phone and I go to Instagram, even as a marketer, as somebody that does this all the time, when I go to my phone to do that, I’m probably checking out. I’m taking a break. I am in a relaxed headspace.  

And so I think people often kind of trip themselves up by assuming that the headspace that the consumer in is in the buying decision brain space for that product when they see that ad or that piece of content or that influencer, rather than they might see this when they’re literally about to fall asleep, is the last thing they saw. So how do you make an impact?  or how do you not make it easy for them to make a purchase?  

Kelly Wiethuchter (29:26): 

How do you make it easy for them to make the purchase?  

Chalice Jones (29:27): 

Exactly. How do you not rely on them having to do 10 more things to be able to stay connected with your brand, keep them tethered to you in easy ways? So really meeting them, thinking through not just who your audience is, but what posture might they be in when they’re engaging on that platform, so your content can meet that as well. 

Strategies for Effective Social Commerce

Ruben Quinones (29:51): 

How about if they don’t have an idea, Kelly, how do you help out, I guess, a brand when it comes to matching them up, either with platforms or with these thought leaders? Are you able to help them drive that at all? Or again, is it that they have to have this blueprint? What does that look like for you? 

Kelly Wiethuchter (30:13): 

A lot of times the blueprint is dependent on what type of an eCommerce platform they’re sitting on. Where are they trying to drive the sale? Are they trying to do it through a TikTok shop or do they want to try to drive it through their owned site? And probably because margins are better, but then a lot of times we’ve had other clients that come and say, Hey, we’re really trying to push for this specific product to be purchased at Walmart. So I think it’s knowing what the KPI is, what the goal is, and then making sure that the creator understands that.  

Am I pushing a discount code that’s going to go back and work on your link? Am I pushing an affiliate sale back to Amazon? So I think there’s a lot of initial conversations that have to be made and decided on, and some of it’s already preci before the agency or the technology partner ever even comes to the table to have the conversation. 

Ruben Quinones (31:06): 

You bring up a, sorry, go ahead. PEs. 

Chalice Jones (31:08): 

No. Yeah, and I think that with all these things historically things like social, they can feel like those upper funnel, some people might call them fluffy kind of initiatives that don’t have that same weight. But again, s of being a performance marketing agency and having our message, and yes, doing a little bit of self-promotion here, but being so data-driven and data led, we need to be able to make that difference at the bottom of the funnel too.  

And that’s where influencer creator and really social commerce make this beautiful kind of midway point because they’re able to really build that brand equity and build that clout and that upper funnel kind of trust and emotional connection with the consumer, while also providing a really easy road to be able to move to that bottom part of the funnel. So we’re able to make those gains. 

Kelly Wiethuchter (32:03): 

Sorry, and building on that influencer piece, and I know your agency does this really well, how do I take that piece of content and repurpose it on our organic channels? So when people are in that lean back mode and they’re coming to your storefront, are they seeing other people who look like them talking about the product and then the pieces of content that are doing really well, how do you then amplify that by putting paid media dollars behind it and getting in front of a wider audience? Right, so expanding that and expanding that frequency. 

Chalice Jones (32:34): 

And I know that’s something that, again, Tagger Sprout, everyone we’ve talked about today is really pushing, which is something that we’ve not, there’s a reason that it’s the talking point, which is that it works when we take that influencer, their content, and we put those paid dollars behind it, we see we have handful of case studies where we’ve seen those things lead to much higher click-through rates, much better conversion because there is this kind of authenticity, it’s kind of breaking through that internal brain ad blocker that’s going on because we’re able to connect and lead with authenticity rather than that brand message. And that’s not to say that there shouldn’t be a brand message and that we shouldn’t be running brand ads. We have to. That’s really important part of the creating the surround sound 360 experience for the consumer, but it works really well. And so it’s not just an idea, but it’s proven. 

Kelly Wiethuchter (33:35): 

Branded search queries increase when you have an influencer out there. I mean, I know connected TV and a lot of them will say that too, but the more you’re putting your brand out there, the more people are likely to start searching. One last thing, I read an interesting little tidbit about Gen Z predominantly uses TikTok as their search engine, which probably has to kill our friends at Google, but that’s where they’re going to learn and discover about new products. 

Chalice Jones (34:03): 

Exactly. And so comes, sorry, go ahead, Ruben. We’re 

Ruben Quinones (34:07): 

No, keep going. No, you’re good. You’re good. Because 

Chalice Jones (34:10): 

That comes with it, the rise of social search. 

Ruben Quinones (34:13): 

No, been, sorry, seen talking about that, go ahead. 

Chalice Jones (34:14): 

No, you’re fine. No, you’re fine. We’ve been talking about the rises of social search and how important that is, and social commerce is such a big piece of that. So if somebody is, again, to what Kelly was saying, if the consumer goes and searches starts their search on TikTok and they want to know what it is and they’re able to buy it right there because your store is there, your shop set up, again, there’s your sale, and while maybe some of your margins might not be as strong, your breadth of reach and turning, especially if you’re converting people who are social users, your chance of converting people who become brand loyalists, brand advocates are sharing your content, are building it up, have this ripple halo effect that’s going to really lead to strong results over time. 

Ruben Quinones (35:01): 

Yeah, I was going to say, what was I going to say? No, the TikTok, I’ve been talking about that for a while, how Gen Z’s using it as their search tool. So I wonder, I think for the brands, I think they’re compromising on margins, let’s say for having a shop on either meta or TikTok talk. This might be more of a media question, but you guys can chime in, but is there, at what point are you compromising or is it worth the squeeze, I guess, and how much could you balance that out? That’s more of a philosophical question. 

Kelly Wiethuchter (35:51): 

I think that one’s a hard one to answer in a very general way because margins are so different across products. We know that food has a much smaller, more margin than obviously makeup or things like that. So I think that’s kind of hard to tell. And I think that’s also part of doing your due diligence and building a good social commerce strategy. Where does it make the most sense for us as a business to be driving the ultimate sale and how can we make it as easy as possible for our users? 

Chalice Jones (36:23): 

It really goes back to some of those principles too. When you’re building out your eCommerce, your website, CX, CRO, all these things, right? Sorry, UX, not UX, apologize, but we do all this testing and learning to make sure that consumers are having the easiest journey to making that final point and that final decision. And so again, this is just another piece of that in a place that your consumer already is, 

Ruben Quinones (36:49): 

And I may answer this myself again because it’s more media question, but I think there are several ways to do it in that we have clients that just market to their list, they upload it to these platforms and they drive to this site. So there’s definitely a way to at least test a, is there an incremental opportunity if we did it in platforms to our audiences versus on site, what are we compromising? So there actually is a way, at least for the first party data that you have, 

Chalice Jones (37:20): 

And I think a good foray into some of that too, is one, analyzing, if you’re just driving to their site, what’s the engagement? What’s happening for them on social? It’s analyzing if your social space is kind of prime for that, and then doing some of your probably lower investment, it’s going to be a lift, but lower financial investment pieces, like whenever we talk about organic strategies, yes, technically it’s free. It doesn’t cost us anything to post, but it does cost money to obviously develop the content, but you’re able to start developing that community.  

Another great way on top of that is, again, using influencers or creators, UGC, all sorts of things to start to sass out a little bit. If your audience has a taste for that, is that resonating with them? It’s a great way you can start on a really small skill, especially if you’re using paid dollars. 

If you’re already running paid advertising, you have some influencer content, 1, 2, 3 pieces, you can run that in your paid, just run it up against your other ads, see how it goes, test and learn, ab test it. You’ll see if again, even that uploaded email list has a taste for it.  

And if it does, that might even indicate that they’re a little bit more, if it’s in a real kind of clear influencer style that they have a social leaning and that you should really maybe lean in and that could then inform building out your social commerce even more. So there’s ways to kind of crawl, walk, run it a little bit to really see if your audience has a propensity for resonating with that type of content. 

The Role of Paid Advertising in Social Commerce

Ruben Quinones (39:00): 

Yeah, no, absolutely. I guess you guys, Kelly, you hit it on a few times, paid even work being on these platforms. I mean, obviously if you’re on these platforms, hopefully you are doing some pay play, but if you integrate influencers, thought leaders, I mean, are you really stumbling or are you shooting your own foot? If you’re not putting some pay dollars behind this, it’s almost like, Hey, you’re really missing out. I feel like I know the answer to this question, but I’m curious your thoughts. 

Chalice Jones (39:34): 

Yeah, I think it’s, and Kelly, I’d love to know your thoughts too, but I think it’s really, it’s what you’re trying to accomplish. I think that there’s so much power that comes with the paid, but again, when we’re talking about brand equity, it’s also a great, again, the minute somebody sees this, even if it’s tiny and faded and gray at the top and hidden in the corner, it says sponsored, there’s still that kind of like, okay, I know I’m being sold to right now.  

Or if it says eligible for commission, we still kind of have that blocker that goes up. So having a mix of it is really good because again, when they see it just organically, it’s a lot easier to not have that kind of reaction. But it depends on what you’re trying to accomplish. But I think that there’s so much room to put more power behind influencer content than what people maybe take advantage of. And that’s a hundred percent our philosophy. But I’m sure the British favorite answer, which is that it kind of depends.  

Ruben Quinones (40:33): 

Also, I know that’s the whole digital answer. Well, it depends. It depends. I used to hate when I’m like, I’ll stop with you. It depends, but I’m like, it really does. Kelly, was there everything else you’re going to add to that or 

Kelly Wiethuchter (40:45): 

I was going to say, not every piece of influencer content demands paid dollars behind it. I think if it is a piece of content that performed really well in that organic space against that creator’s reach already, then yes, maybe it’s one that we want to elevate and try to see if we can squeeze more sales out of it. But not every creator is going to lend that same type of broader reach. I actually see this a lot with home chef. There’s a creator I follow, and every so often a paid piece of her content comes up. It started out organic. I was a loyal following, I saw it, and they keep bringing this one up, and I giggle because on the marketing side I’m like, well, I know that actually drives sales, right?

Even though that was an older piece of content, and I’m sure there’s been other pieces of content they’ve tried from other creators, but it hasn’t worked, but they had to get the tried and true. Did it work organically before? We’re going to continue to put dollars behind it. There’s only so much money at the end of the day. 

Chalice Jones (41:46): 

Totally. And Ruben, you kind hit on this a little bit too, but yes, when you’re in health and wellness and beauty, I think there’s a big focus, again, table stakes about what the expectation is for your social presence organically and your relationship with creators. And while it is and should be table stakes for almost all brands, there are still some clients that we’re still trying to persuade need to be there, especially the ones that are running paid. You kind of said hopefully they’re putting some paid dollars behind it if they’re on organically, but I feel like more often we’re seeing people that’ll kind of be there doing paid and are not really living up to what they should be organically.  

That’s another opportunity where someone might be missing a lot of opportunity to really, I don’t want to call it low hanging fruit, but those easy opportunities to connect with a company without having to follow through on an ad and being like, I’m going to follow her. I’m going to like, or I’m going to because I like this. Letting the algorithm keep showing them that content, they engage with it organically. There’s a lot of cool opportunity there as well. 

Ruben Quinones (42:56): 

Yeah, and again, we’re talking about social commerce. You don’t have to have a shop. You could have an influencers go directly to the site. But I guess takeaways for me is I like the deep versus shallow approach. Don’t try to boil the ocean, try to hone in on one or two platforms that has your audiences. Another thing I guess I could think of is you can upload your first party data to these audiences to see what the match rate is that actually might provide some direction. But then doing that, and I guess it’s not putting cream on top using putting cream on top. You know what it is? I had a London fog latte in my vanilla cold foam on, so I’m still thinking about the crane. But you don’t have to do both, but it will provide more velocity when you’re doing, you’ve got the platform set up and you have influencers as well, you’re just going to get more mileage out of it.  

So I mean, I guess optimizing social commerce, that’s the ideal that you’re representative on those platforms, but then that you’re being authentic and getting more mileage by putting some paid dollars behind that authenticity to reach their audiences. Okay. Okay.  

Kelly Wiethuchter (44:23): 

I approve. 

Key Takeaways

Ruben Quinones (44:25): 

Alright, I guess we’ll leave with parting thoughts. I want to thank you for your time, but yeah, maybe tell us, you came in first, so I’ll, what can you lead us off with before we head on to the weekend and the last few weekends of the summer?  

Chalice Jones (44:45)  
Just to marinate on over the weekend as we’re all just really considering our marketing strategies on Saturday? Absolutely. No, but I’d say that it’s just truly understanding who your consumer is and doing your due diligence and kind of getting your assumptions out of the way, and then understanding that you are there to create a holistic experience for them. And with each one of these touch points, you are creating an experience and something that hopefully either causes them to remember you in a good or a bad way. And the bad way might be that they don’t remember you. And so thinking about holistically and thinking about how can you take advantage of the whole user journey on social, you’re going to get a lot more mileage out of the efforts and the content that you’re developing for that. 

Ruben Quinones (45:34): 

Very good. If people want to connect with you, put it up on the screen. It’s Chalice Jones, you go on LinkedIn, you can follow her. I don’t know if you hear that banging. Sorry about that. So Chalice, I’ll let you go. Thank you for your contributions. And Kelly, yeah, any parting thoughts? 

Kelly Wiethuchter (45:54): 

Yeah, don’t be afraid of influencers, but do your research, work with a trusted partner like amps of, and make sure you’ve really thought out what that plan looks like. You’ve really did a good job vetting those creators, making sure that their audiences is who you’re looking to reach. The creators again, are talking about brands that are similar. It doesn’t always have to be a competitor, but is this something that I know my target audience is already shopping or buying from, I think is another really important one. And then finally, just have fun with it.  

Creators are going to do what they know what to do best. Don’t micromanage them. Give them the opportunity to be creative and have fun with your brand and they’ll create good work for you and hopefully it drives sales. That’s what I’ve got for you. Oh, no, you’re muted again! 

Ruben Quinones (46:56): 

Sorry, but it sounded like I knew what I was talking about. Right? So Kelly, thank you so much. I appreciate your contributions. You can follow Kelly on LinkedIn as well. She works with us on our campaigns as well. So you can get the package of two in one. You can get jealous and Kelly if you ever work with us. But I appreciate you providing contributions to the conversations around social commerce and its importance. So thank you. We’ll do this again in the near future. Take care. 

Kelly Wiethuchter (47:27): 

Take care. 

Ruben Quinones (47:28): 

Right. So we have another one in the books, guys, guys, guys. It’s the end of summer, but we’re heading into Q4. And so I’d have to do some shameless plug for the next session that we have coming up, which is going to be with Google. And we are going to be talking about Q4 insights or if you’re an eCommerce brand or retail, you don’t want to miss out on that one.  

We’re going to look at, and I know it’s an election year, but we’re going to look at patterns from the prior years, especially last Q4, what to expect going into the Q4 season. We’ll look at different categories within the E-com space. So again, if you’re in retail that you don’t want to miss out on this one, as we’re going to have AJ and Enon from our team AJ with Google, to talk through what you need to know about anticipation of Q4 and some of the patterns to look out for. 

So I appreciate your time. Thank you for tuning in. I know you’re busy, but I think if you are like me, you wake up each and every day and you’re humble about the fact that there’s so much to know in this space, which is one of the reasons why I do this. I learn a lot just having conversations. So hopefully you do as well.  

And so follow us on LinkedIn, on Amsive, we post this on the blog as well, on the Amsive blog, but also we send out some emails just letting you know the upcoming sessions. So with that, I want to thank you for tuning in. So good morning, a good afternoon, good evening, wherever you’re watching this, whenever you’re watching this. And I will see you next time. 

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